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If Rangers Or Any Other SPL Club Had To Reform



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Poll: If Rangers Or Any SPL Club Had To Reform (20 member(s) have cast votes)

Should they be voted back in to the SPL or start in the third division (pinched question from Radio Scotland who were asking it tonight ;-) )

  1. They should stay in the SPL no restrictions (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. They should stay in the SPL but with penalties (2 votes [10.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.00%

  3. They should start again in the Third Division (18 votes [90.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 90.00%

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#41 Psychoheart

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 11:34 AM

View Postsheeptastic, on 04 March 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:



Very true mate, but her is a question for you, just the same as some SPL chairman are wanting to keep the 12 team league or maybe go to a ten team league due in part to wanting to keep their extra OF games how many chairman do you think might vote to keep Rangers in the spl for the same reasons?? ie Cash

That could be the clincher sadly. But I think they'll need to balance that with pissing off their own fans who still give a toss about sporting integrity.

#42 sheeptastic

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 11:40 AM

View PostPsychoheart, on 04 March 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

That could be the clincher sadly. But I think they'll need to balance that with pissing off their own fans who still give a toss about sporting integrity.

well I for one would be raging if Stewart Milne let them off the hook for the sake of getting Aberdeen some money, even if it made our existence that bit harder, unfortunately I think he would just think of the cash and not the integrity aspect

#43 Grumpy Old Man

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:54 AM

John Yorkston states that he wouldn't be comfortable if Rangers were reformed and parachuted straight into the SPL. Obviously he has his own clubs self interest at heart as it would appear the only way they will escape relation was if Rangers went under and didn't come straight back into the SPL but it would be interesting to see how the other chairmen felt about this.

Quote

http://sport.stv.tv/...gers-spl-entry/

Dunfermline Athletic chairman John Yorkston says he is uncomfortable over the prospect of any ‘new Rangers’ being given a free pass into the Scottish Premier League.

Rangers are currently in administration and have been docked 10 points by the SPL. Player redundancies are expected on Monday, with £1m a month needing to be cut from the club’s overheads.


Administrators Duff and Phelps raised the possibility over the weekend of the current club being liquidated, meaning a new club could be formed to inherit Rangers’ assets.


SPL rules allow for the member share of a liquidated club to be transferred to another company, providing 90% of clubs agree on possible sanctions and the league’s board then approve the sale.


Yorkston would be one of the persons voting on any side inheriting Rangers’ member share and he says he is unsure if his club would give their approval.


“We have problems with that,” said Yorkston when asked for his thoughts on the prospect of a new Rangers being allowed into the SPL.


“We have a different view if they go into administration and come out of that. But if they go into liquidation, would we vote for them?


“We would have to see what's behind it all. It's an awkward one.


“There are always scenarios each way. But we have to look at all the facts first before we make a hard and fast rule.


“As we speak today, if they come out of administration I personally feel it's a clean slate job. If it's liquidation, it's a completely different kettle of fish.”


Yorkston, speaking prior to his attendance at an SPL general meeting over a change on rules to financial fair play, says a Rangers which survives should not be hit with any further sanctions.


If the current company were to cease to exist, the Pars chairman says it could be the case that the new club’s route into the top flight would be blocked, leaving them to apply to join the Scottish Football League.


“I no way am I condoning what's happened at Rangers with Craig Whyte,” he said. “On the other hand, any normal company coming out of administration comes out with a clean slate.


“If they come out of administration, that's what happens. Liquidation is a completely different situation and they may well have to go down to the Third Division.


“We would have to look at it and see what all the facts are.


“The SPL has got to accept a new application. That would depend if the members were inclined to accept it or not.


“If they went to the SFL, I am sure they would want them to start in the lowest division.


When all’s said and done it’s only a game.

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#44 hayza

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 12:46 PM

Only a coincidence that its his team that would escape relegation if the dodgers are liquidated,mmm ;)

#45 craig

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 12:55 PM

View Posthayza, on 05 March 2012 - 12:46 PM, said:

Only a coincidence that its his team that would escape relegation if the dodgers are liquidated,mmm ;)
:thumbup:
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#46 Psychoheart

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 01:03 PM

View Posthayza, on 05 March 2012 - 12:46 PM, said:

Only a coincidence that its his team that would escape relegation if the dodgers are liquidated,mmm ;)

Just as it's pure coincidence that Yorkston made these rumblings and Rangers administrators agreed to pay the money owed.

#47 hayza

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 01:07 PM

:thumbup: .

#48 Bundy

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 02:39 PM

Do I detect a note of cynicism among you? :lol:

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#49 sheeptastic

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 04:15 PM

View PostBundy, on 05 March 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

Do I detect a note of cynicism among you? :lol:

there's a fine line between cynicism and realism ;)

#50 JHR

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 04:27 PM

View Postsheeptastic, on 04 March 2012 - 11:40 AM, said:

well I for one would be raging if Stewart Milne let them off the hook for the sake of getting Aberdeen some money, even if it made our existence that bit harder, unfortunately I think he would just think of the cash and not the integrity aspect

You may well be the only one who could be raging Prof.. it's always the money..
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#51 JHR

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 04:31 PM

View PostGrumpy Old Man, on 05 March 2012 - 10:54 AM, said:

John Yorkston states that he wouldn't be comfortable if Rangers were reformed and parachuted straight into the SPL. Obviously he has his own clubs self interest at heart as it would appear the only way they will escape relation was if Rangers went under and didn't come straight back into the SPL but it would be interesting to see how the other chairmen felt about this.

We have touched on this before Grumpy, SPL chaps will be hoping to keep any RFC Club in the top flight.. Likewise the third division chaps will be seeing big pay days
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#52 CHURCHILL

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 04:54 PM

Oh,b*****. Just Queen`s Park`s luck to get promoted out of the 3rd Division just as the FGR join it!
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#53 Grumpy Old Man

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 09:02 AM

Mr Traynor's thoughts on the matter.

Quote

http://blogs.dailyre...f-recovery.html

Rangers continue to sway precariously on the edge of oblivion with the SFA standing right behind not quite sure if they should sink the boot in and send them on their way or lend a hand to keep them upright.



And while Rangers teeter on the brink, 10 of the other SPL clubs plan a meeting to see if there might be ways of taking advantage of cataclysmic insolvency to improve their lot.
Celtic won't be at that gathering but they don't have to be there. Don't think for a moment they haven't been in touch with some of the others, just to make sure that should Rangers lurch into liquidation they must be punished for years to come.
All in the interests of sporting integrity, you understand.
A fresh and increasingly farcical chapter is added to the story of this 140-year-old club with every passing week. Tom Sharpe himself might have been proud of this tale.
If Rangers do slide into liquidation of course they should suffer further sanctions. But if they are kicked too much while they are down they might never fully recover and that would serve no good purpose other than to satisfy those of an overly-vindictive predisposition.
Some say Rangers, if liquidation can't be avoided, should be kicked out of the SPL and forced to start again at the very bottom, the Scottish Football League's Third Division where there would be a space because no one would be relegated from the SPL.
The knock-on effect would leave the lowest division short and the SFL are not going to deny the "new" Rangers a place. Of, course they aren't. That would be the biggest act of folly yet if they did.
But although there is no chance of a newco being denied their SPL licence it would actually be no bad thing for a new Rangers if they did begin their regeneration at the bottom.
Especially if the value of their top players, Allan McGregor, Steve Davis, and Steven Naismith, has been downgraded too much by the deals agreed with the club's administrators last week.
If, for instance, McGregor now has a clause in his contract which states he can leave in the summer for say, £1.5million, he won't be short of offers. The price would climb because of bidding but even so, Rangers would lose the country's top keeper for a pittance. And it could be the same deal with the others.
If this is the case, and do not be surprised if it is, new owners would have to find another huge pile of money just to fill the gaps and become any kind of threat to Celtic.
The administrators were determined to keep value in the squad but if they've conceded too much in these clauses, which took an age to agree last week, new owners could be put off when they realise just how much they might have to fork out after having gained control of the club.
They'd be powerless to stop the best players leaving at knockdown prices even if they would have to give all of them the amounts lost by the 75 per cent wage cuts.
New owners might well be picking up a false economy and if they are buying Rangers from liquidation, rather than plead for the SPL licence, it might be much more economical to turn to the SFL instead.
Rangers wouldn't be allowed back into Europe for three years in any case because UEFA rules demand only clubs registered with their domestic associations for at least three years can play in the Champions or Europa Leagues. As a deterrent to others the SPL would probably insist Rangers start each of the next three, possibly four, seasons with a hefty points deduction but could that be justified if the Ibrox side spent at least three years in the lower reaches? Frankly, I don't think it could.
Rangers must be hit hard if they lapse into liquidation but starting at the very bottom is exactly that, a severe punishment. It would certainly be vindictive if they had to face further sanctions when they emerged from the SFL after a few seasons.
If the calls and messages which flow into BBC Radio Scotland's Your Call every Saturday evening can be used as a gauge a lot of supporters believe Rangers should be sent all the way down. But when you think of it everyone, apart from clubs in the SPL, would actually benefit for a while.
If Rangers fans stuck with the programme and continued to support their side in large numbers think of the money that would be generated for the likes of East Stirling, Clyde, Peterhead, Annan and other little outfits in the first year.
It would be the same for clubs in the Second and First Divisions as Rangers moved up through the levels but the clubs in the SPL would miss that revenue and they'd also suffer from a watered-down TV deal. Unless the likes of Dunfermline, Aberdeen, and Hibs actually think they are the attraction for the telly people.
Although Paul Murray's Blue Knights are determined to rescue the club by CVA it will be a long time before Rangers are steady on their feet if they are bought out of administration.
The process would be slow with prudence the watchword. But there might be periods of unrest and anger among the fans who would grow weary of seeing their team lose out to Celtic on a regular basis while waiting for the good times to roll again. And there could be no guarantee they ever would.
With a points penalty at the start of each of the handful of seasons Rangers would have no chance of the title and would also be up against it to qualify for Europe, although they won't be able to play next season because they will miss the UEFA deadline for exiting administration.
Given the severity of the SPL sanctions which would await Rangers if they are liquidated it would make more sense for the new club to start in the SFL. Clubs there would benefit and provided Rangers were backed by their fans, money could be saved on wages by letting the main players leave and then bringing in others good enough to make sure each division could be dominated on the way back up.
Their younger players could flourish and a new outfit could build a cash reserve for the day they returned to the SPL, which might be in pretty bad shape by then because of diminished revenues caused by Rangers' absence.


So, when the SPL clubs get together this week, perhaps they should think ahead. And be very careful about what they wish for.


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#54 Grumpy Old Man

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 09:55 AM

And as if by magic Bill Leckie also has his say.

Quote

ALL of us on the outside have tried to look interested for as long as humanly possible.



But somebody's got to say it out loud sometime. So it might as well be me.


This whole Rangers business would officially give a Nurofen a migraine.
Don't get me wrong. I sincerely hope everyone at Ibrox keeps their jobs and that the fans keep their club and that the bad guys get what's coming to them and blahdy blahdy blah.
There are, however, times in life — when the wife's nagging or a teacher's droning on or Coldplay are playing — that no matter how important those making the noise think they are, you can't help but tune out.
For me, that moment came in an Indian restaurant the other day where a bunch of us had been invited to pick the players and managers of the month in the Irn-Bru leagues.
A Celtic-daft colleague from one of the posh papers couldn't stop going on about the evils of Rangers.
They'd cheated their way to Nine-In-A-Row. They must be punished for issuing illegal contracts. Their use of Employee Benefit Trusts was clearly against the law. If they get away with agreeing a Company Voluntary Agreement, it's a disgrace. There's an outside possibility he even suggested UEFA should strip them of the 1972 Cup Winners' Cup "just because".
Seriously. Another five minutes of it and I'd have lapsed into a korma.
Then I get home and there's an email from a Rangers punter about it all. Well, I say 'email', when it was more like an extended disc of War and Peace.
Chapter upon chapter and verse after verse after verse about how when David Murray paid stars through offshore EBTs it wasn't illegal and how retrospective punishment would be wrong and how it might have been different if they hadn't paid the players in question, but they had, so how could anyone say their victories weren't fair and square? And anyway, what about stripping Celtic of their titles because of the Boys Club scandal and on and on and bloody on.
Now, they might both have been making valid points. But from the start of my irate fellow journalist's rant to the end of Mr Defiant Bluenose's screed of harumphing, it sunk home that, quite simply, I really didn't care.
Again, this isn't a case of not caring about the perilous position one of Scotland's biggest clubs finds itself in, because it's a hugely serious matter and remains a major news story.
It's just, well, there must be plenty more out there who've long since started glazing over at the hectares of newsprint and hours of airtime being devoted to the kind of nit-picking detail that will be, without doubt, crucial to any future court cases or HMRC hearings.
But which engage the average non-Old Firm punter as much as the kind of BBC Four documentary that has more people working on it than watching it. Who promised what to whom. Who claims to have been lied to by who else. Who claims the ones saying they were told lies are actually the liars. Who reckons they were conned out of what money and whose millions are in what legal firm's bank accounts.
There's barely a word of it that anyone but the absolutely obsessive either understands or is remotely interested in.
You know what's most boring of all about this story, though?
The fact that it so quickly, so totally — and so chuffing inevitably — became not about Rangers v the Taxman or right v wrong, but about Blue versus Green.
There genuinely does seem to be no issue that Old Firm fans will not twist and mangle into another reason to abuse each other.
If Al-Qaeda invaded and turned Britain into an Islamic State, they'd have a square go about whether it was a Proddy Islamic State or a Catholic Islamic State.
And, of course, no matter how often anyone else says we can't be doing with either of them, they will never stop picking apart our every syllable to try and prove we're lying.
Take this email that came in on Friday, at first glance taking issue with a column I'd written in the news pages about gay marriage, but which went on to claim that "you're just upset because your team's going to fold".
It's moments like that, reading gibberish like that, when you really start to wonder what the bloody point is.
I think — this could be miles off the mark — that it would be a fair reflection of how fans of the other 40 Scottish clubs feel about the Rangers tax case to say we DON'T feel cheated out of titles, because our teams were never going to win them anyway. But we DO feel that if they haven't paid their taxes and have issued illegal contracts, they should be made to pay in legal and sporting terms.
In the case of the latter, my hope would be that if they go into liquidation they're chucked out of the EssPeeEll and made to state the case against the likes of Cove Rangers for the spare place created in the Third Division.
Do what's fair. Do what's right. Do what has to be done to discourage others from acting in such a reckless manner.
But more than anything, please do it soon.
So the rest of us can get back to that thing we used to call football.

Read more: http://www.thescotti...l#ixzz1otXnlqMW


Edited by Grumpy Old Man, 12 March 2012 - 09:56 AM.

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#55 johnarob

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 10:17 AM

so basically.....damned if you do damned if you don't!
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#56 Psychoheart

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 01:47 PM

Leckie's in the wrong job if he's bored with the story. A massive story in Scottish sport and he's a sports writer that doesn't want to write about it. Bizarre.

And the less said about him agreeing with the idea that Celtic should be stripped of their titles because of events at Celtic Boys Club the better. Disgusting point scoring, one that I'm not sure required highlighting at all let alone suggesting "might have been making valid points".

#57 johnarob

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 01:58 PM

the only decent thing in leckie's rant is the last 3 lines

the rest of it is not fit for purpose
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